What To Do Before, During, And After Speaking At Summits With Jenn Zellers

TRANSCRIPT AUTOMATICALLY GENERATED [00:00:25] Diane: Hey, Hey, today's guest Jen Zellers as a virtual summit matchmaker. She connects audiences with great summits and they hosted great speakers. If you've spoken at a summit before you will know that it is a lot of work and that you want to make sure that you're using that opportunity effectively to grow your business. So if that is on your 2022 strategy, listen closely. Hey Jen, welcome to the. [00:00:46] Jenn: Hey, I'm so excited to be here. [00:00:48] Diane: So let's kick off with the quick intro to you and your business. [00:00:52] Jenn: Yeah. So I equipped virtual summit hosts and speakers to create ongoing reach and impact from their one hit wonder events. And so I do that with hosts through evergreen summits and then with speakers through creating their summit speaker strategy and their standout, some has bregar framework. [00:01:09] Diane: Okay. I have a lot of questions. So, so recently I have been lucky enough to get some amazing speaking opportunities. And I love the opportunity to nerd out on my favorite topics with an audience, but I also feel like. In that summits, there's a lot of overwhelmed for the audience because there are a lot of speakers each with an opt-in each with an offer. So it doesn't always necessarily convert for me from raving excited comments in the chat to emails and sales down the line. What should I be thinking about before I even take a speaking gig? [00:01:42] Jenn: Yeah, so I always work backwards. You figure out what your main topic should be. And typically I recommend having one, like signature, main topic that people will always go to you for. And then a couple of secondary topics that. Can kind of supplement the main topic where maybe it's not what you talk about all the time, but it definitely relates back to what you do and who you are. So. Typically the way that I do it, as you look at the offers that you have. So the paid offers and the free offers, so that cause you really want to get those returns. You want people to opt into your email list. You want to make sales from it. And if your speaking topics are not related back to the things that you offer, it's not going to do that. I've seen people go and do a talk on same mindset and how to grow your business through mindset and then have. A freebie on marketing, like social media or something like that. And it has absolutely no connection to what they just talked about. Maybe, maybe it does technically relate back and they talk about mindset through that, but they don't talk about that in the presentation. And it sort of feels like it's coming out of left field. So you definitely want to make sure that what you're talking about connects directly to a. Free opt-in that is going to give them the next step. And this is going to help them take action on what you talked about in the presentation and get the results that you're talking about. So you don't have to equip them to do all the things that you teach through your presentation, but you want to direct them towards taking that next step with you specifically. [00:03:15] Diane: so you want to make sure that it's like a logical next step. So it's not the thing you talk about in the first five minutes. It's hopefully something that you've built to and you go, okay. Now, what do you, how do you take action on those? Oh, look here. I have a resource for you to help you, that kind of vibe. Okay. now. I'm recording my presentation. Well, actually, let me ask you, does it make a difference? Do I need a different strategy if I'm speaking live or if I'm feeling. [00:03:38] Jenn: typically with live, there's going to be some interaction components. So you might be asking the attendees questions to kind of gauge where they're at in their journey and what you're going to be talking about. So like, When I talk about summit speaking, I could be talking to folks who've never spoken before, or they own a business. They are definitely experts in what they do, but they have no idea where to start when it comes to speaking. Or it might be talking to folks who've done a few summit speaking engagements, but they've like, you haven't gotten the results they were hoping or expecting. And so they would have. Take on it, then even someone who's spoken at summits, a lot art, they have dialed in their strategy, or maybe they've spoken at in-person events, but they're having trouble going and translating their speaking experience into the online world. So. If you're doing a live event, you can ask questions to kind of get an idea and you can have your presentation. Like if you're doing slides or something like that, you can have slides that will apply to those different areas. But if you do some audience mining, essentially ask those questions, get those answers while you're doing the presentation, you can tweak what you actually say to better relate back to what the audience, where the audience is in that journey rather than. Going and doing a presentation for completely new summit speakers in my case. And then finding out that, oh, these folks have all spoken and they do get leads, but they're not making the sales. They want. Then they're not going to care as much about what I'm saying versus if I can tweak that a little bit. And I know my audience and I know my topic, I can change it up a little bit on the fly to better relate back to them. Versus if you're doing a prerecorded presentation, then you can go and do some of that research. You can ask the host if they know. Who the people are going to be, and they may not be a hundred percent on it. Like they there's always going to be people that they don't expect. They don't know their speakers audiences as well. And so. You can still get a pretty good gauge on it, but you can structure a prerecorded presentation a lot better than you can for a live presentation. And in my experience, like if you're given the option of doing an interview with the host, which may or may not be live with the audience but either way, doing that versus doing a prerecorded presentation with say slides or a screen-share, I have found at least for the summits that I've attended or that I've hosted. And a lot of the summits that my clients have hosted. The attendees seem to connect a lot better with the prerecorded presentations, where the speaker has thought about what they're going to talk about a little bit more than an interview style. And they have a very clear progression of the different steps that someone should take to get the results that they're promising. [00:06:23] Diane: and it's probably the best version of their talk. Like some people are going to get a bit more nervous when they're live. They're not as happy on their feet. So I think. I think it's an interesting dynamic having done both. I'm not sure which I prefer. Usually in the moment it's the one I'm not doing. So like, if I'm having to record something, I'm wishing it was just live. And then when I'm about to go live and wishing it was recorded. But I guess that's human nature. So I've thought about my topic. I've connected it to my customer journey. How do I go about making sure that I'm finding the right summits for me? [00:06:58] Jenn: Yeah, so that is definitely a question that I've gotten a lot enough, so that I specifically had a session and I had my last summit where we. Did it specifically for summit speakers and how to book more summits and make more sales on it. And I specifically made sure to have a session about choosing summits that aligned with your values in there, because I get so many questions about it and it can feel hard because there's so many different types of summits. Like. There's what I call slimy summits, where sleazy ones, where they come at you and they give you a really generic pitch. They say, Hey, I love your website. And they always seem to say website, they don't say anything specific about you or your website. And they say, I'd really love to have you on generic summit topic. We're recording right now and it's going live in three weeks and you need to have 5,000 people on your email list. Those ones are usually a pretty easy one to notice they know to, but then there are going to be ones where they have a speaker info page and the timing seems okay, but you just don't get a, it doesn't feel right. It doesn't sit right with you even though like maybe the audiences just slightly off, like, it seems like it should be a match, but it's not quite exactly who you want to speak to. You. Always have to be your specific target audience, but there needs to at least be a large portion of them in the summits target audience. And if the host is pitching you where it's not quite the right fit, They're probably pitching other speakers where it's not the right fit either. And that means that your ideal audience is not going to be the majority there. So it's little things like that that you can look out for, or it may be that you start talking with them and it seemed like at the beginning, it seems like a good fit, but the more you talk to them, the more you get this weird feeling that it's not going to come together in a way that feels good. The host is maybe asking you for things that like, why do you need this? Or. Whatever it happens to be, or their communication is really lacking or their systems are not well put together. And like, we all have tech glitches. I've had stuff with my speakers where my system's not supposed to send them something and it does. And it happens. But if the host isn't, isn't owning it and isn't working to make sure that you as a speaker are well taken care of, it's probably not the best fit. So. My key ones are wanting, don't say yes to the ones where they're asking you for 5,000 people on your email list. It's not worth that even if you did, it's still not a good fit. But then also make sure that your audience is well aligned, like really, really well aligned with the summit audience. And if the host doesn't have a specific audience in mind, if they're like it's moms or it's women in business, what, what does that mean? Technically, yes, we identify as moms, but is it moms of toddlers? Is it moms of teenagers? Is it moms of special needs kids, something like that is going to make it a lot easier for you to dial in on, are my people here and just do a little bit of research on the host is the host like engaging with their audience? If, if it feels like a list, grab. It probably is. So just kind of go with your gut, but also know what your values are and if the host isn't aligned with them, it's okay to say no. As a summit host, I would much rather someone say no to speaking at my summit. If it's not a good fit for them, if it's not a good fit for their audience, or if they're not going to be able to promote. So like, if you look at the timeline and you're like, I have a launch coming up during that, it's probably not going to be a good fit because. You really should be promoting the summit as a speaker. If you're going to be speaking it's because it should be a resource for your audience. And not just because you want to grab the list or get sales out of it. Like I've used summits as a way for me to expand my audiences circles and who they're listening to. And if the speakers that are speaking to that summit are not people that I want my audience listening to. I've turned out of summits. But a lot of it does come down to knowing yourself, knowing your audience and just kind of go in with your gut, honestly. [00:11:00] Diane: It's really easy to get wrapped up in there. Like, oh, I'm so flooded that I got asked. And to go with that, like really easy yes. In the moment and be all excited and to like skip over this stuff to not go and see who else is on the list to not check out that person on social media, if you've never met them before to not have some kind of like introductory conversation. But actually that's a really hard, no to say like when you're already in and now something feels off, that's a much more. confrontational situation, the closer you get to the summits, if you go back the next day, it's just awkward and embarrassing. But if you go back like the day before the summit, the minute your name has been sent out as a speaker, That is reputationally damaging for you. So I think people really need to understand this stuff, while it sounds like a lot of research and a lot of work is actually going to save you so much pain on the back end. [00:11:53] Jenn: honestly I tell folks just like when, when we're putting together. Like speaker strategies. I tell my clients, just wait a day, just wait one day to respond. 1 24 hours is not going to kill you. It's not going to get you uninvited. Honestly, a lot of the time summit hosts reach out three days later and then a week later, and then they'll take someone off their list. Like they're not going to say, oh, nevermind. I already filled that spot just because you took 24. To get back to them. And also one thing I did forget to mention is that if it's not a topic that aligns with your offers, if it's not something that you speak on or that you can tweak something that you already have in the bag ready to go. it may not be the right fit. If you talk about, say social media marketing, and then someone comes to you and says, can you talk about direct mail marketing? It's not a good fit. It's not going to impact you and it's not going to impact your audience. Don't be afraid to say, no, we'd rather you say no as a summit host, then say yes, and then regret it and back out and leave us scrambling at the last minute . [00:12:58] Diane: Also. Considering that workload yes, visibility is great, but visibly that doesn't convert, you're spent maybe an hour or two developing your presentation. Then you've made the slides, then you've recorded it. Then you've recorded it seven more times until it actually looks like something you would submit to someone, then you've done all the admin off the background, and then you've created all the promo stuff. That's a lot of work for something that isn't potentially going to convert, just so that you have. Visible. So let's say we've done all that. Were recording our presentation. This is the thing that always gets to me in a summit is I want to be So. respectful of this is not my stage. This is somebody else's stage, and I have been invited into it. But at the same time, I still want to say to people like, here's how you can join my email list. How do we do that? Gently or without being sleazy and without making it really awkward with the host. Nobody wants to turn up to a presentation and see 17 slides on the membership that you think everybody should join. [00:13:57] Jenn: Yeah. Nobody wants to feel like a used car salesman when you're speaking at a summit and whether it's prerecorded or you're doing an interview or you're doing a live session or all of the above. Cause sometimes you do all three of those at the same summit, but there's definitely ways to. Make it, so that it's an authentic experience and one that the attendees are actually excited to hear about. You may have noticed, I've mentioned a few times, like when I work with my clients and stuff like that, so that's definitely one way that you can do that. You can grab client stories or examples of how you work with clients and you can build that into. What you talk about, whether, like I said, it's an interview and you're talking about it the way that I am here, or if it's a prerecorded presentation, you might even be able to grab a headshot with your client's permission and share a testimonial or an experience that you shared with them when you were working with them. Or if you have a course, you can get the results that people have gotten after going through the course, just all the little testimonials, the case studies, the results, anything that you can from a client, and then build that in really organically, just in the way that you would talk about it with a friend into your presentation or interview. And it just make it really genuine. Like if you're talking about it and you're really excited, About the results that you've gotten for clients, or you really loved working with this particular person, because X, Y, Z, then you can build that in and you can work it in and say, you have a membership. And you're like, oh yeah. Well, after the first three months of being in this, like this thing that we're talking about here, she took it to the next level and now she's achieved this. And then six months later after that, so her first nine months in there, she'd gotten up to here and. Just giving those, those case studies and results without I'm going to leave up into webinars where they go and they talk for the first 10 or 15 minutes about like, oh, do this and this and that. And then the last 30 minutes, it's just, so-and-so got $10,000 when they did this. And then this person got $25,000 when she did this, these steps that we'd talk about after, after the webinar's over and don't want to do that. But there are ways to work it in, so that it's genuinely helpful for the audience where you're not just showing the best and the brightest of everyone that you've worked with, but you're sharing genuine, real, authentic stories and stories is the way that I approach it versus just here's a billboard, like talk about them as people. [00:16:26] Diane: If someone wants to work with you, they will. If you've explained something really well, and you've just used the client stories to accented and they want those results they're going to go and find you. So it sounds like what you're saying is like, make sure that that presentation is super value driven and it's clear that this is what you help people do. It's not like just some random thing that you're really good at talking about. [00:16:47] Jenn: Yeah. And you can work in. I for some of the speakers that I did do interviews with in the past, they've gone and they've worked their freebie that they have into it. So. If it's journal prompts, they may be talking about some of the journal prompts that are going to be in there, but they say, oh yeah. So like, here's some of the prompts, but you can find those in the journal, the buttons below this, this presentation or whatever it happens to be. So if you know that they're going to let you do a freebie and you know, it's going to be on the page. You can talk about it like that. Just make it really easy for them to find you. [00:17:20] Diane: Okay. Now the summit is live, so we've done all the things. The summit itself is running. What should I be doing? [00:17:26] Jenn: Well, number one would be promoting it is technically up to the summit host to promote the summit, but everybody benefits when all of the speakers share because you're sharing your audience with everyone else, but everyone else is sharing their audience with you as well. The summit is a resource for your audience. If it's not a resource for your audience, if it's not something that's going to help them along the journey that you are taking them through, like our friend of Sola Davis talks about, then you're, you're doing them a disservice first off. So you shouldn't be at that summit. But. You want to be excited about this. It should be something that either you want to attend yourself or that, you know, for a fact that your audience is going to love, they're going to get a ton of value out of it. And so you can again, promote the summit in a really genuine story driven way. You can tell them, Hey, I really think you specifically. We're going to love this session from ABC. And then you should also check out this session from XYZ because they go really well together. And I know we've been talking about, and the podcast or email newsletter, whatever, however, you connect with your audience about this topic, and this is going to help you take it to the next level. These are some things that I don't normally talk about, but I know for a fact they're going to help you so you can do really simple things like that. Most of them had hosts are going to provide you with some sort of promotion assets. So probably some graphics, some swipe copy both for email and social media. There might be requirements for it. Personally, I asked my speakers to send out at least one email and put out at least one social media post on the platform of their choice. But I also don't hunt them down. I've had some hosts who do hunt you down. And again, those are the ones that you want to steer clear off. I've withdrawn from those summits usually. But if you, if it's a resource for your audience, you're going to want them to know about it the same as if it was a product that you were putting together yourself, because what you're doing. Is your establishing your authority and you're building deeper credibility with your audience to do this. Cause you're connecting them with a free resource. Maybe they do upgrade. Maybe they don't to get the all access pass through your affiliate link. But other way, you're connecting them. You're being that connector and people remember connectors in their life, whether it's in business or personally. And so if they're re. Reading the social media posts from one of the other speakers later on. And they're going to remember that you're the one that connected them to the summit, where they found them. So make sure that you're promoting, but also make sure that you're engaging with the attendees. Like that is one of the other things, even if someone's promoting a summit that they're speaking at, engaging with the attendees seems to fall off a lot of people's radar or they feel like. I recorded my presentation and I sent out an email and a social media post. The more you connect with the attendees, whether they're people who are already in your audience where you're building a deeper connection with them, or they're from someone else's audience, whether it's the host or another speaker's audiences originally. They're now going to become part of your audience and part of your community. And they're going to go to you when you're answering their questions or celebrating their wins in the summit community with them. And so the more you engage, whether it's through say a Facebook group, or maybe they host on slack or another channel. And then, or if you are doing a live session where like I've done a VIP speaker lunch where the folks who upgraded their ticket got to come and hang out for an hour with most of the speakers honestly showed up for that or doing an ask me anything Q and a type of panel. There's a lot of different ways you can engage with the attendees. So that is definitely. Probably the two biggest things that you can do while the summit is live to stand out as a speaker and to make your time as a speaker more worthwhile [00:21:12] Diane: I guess as well if you're engaging with them, they're also likely to go and even watch your presentation. Cause it's not just your opt-ins that they're choosing that choosing whether they even give you that time. Okay. Now the summit is over. The audience has had a ton of information at them and usually a big pitch from the. All right. So normally the host has done a full master class training webinar with something that they're selling very specifically. Can I do anything at this point? Or am I now too late? If they didn't grab that, opt-in. [00:21:46] Jenn: no, definitely not. So one thing is if you have attendees that you've connected with in the community, go find them on social media, start following them, comment on their posts, just engage with them on there. And then I don't recommend emailing folks immediately. I do recommend staggering at a bit because. A lot of summit speakers just immediately Chuck people onto their normal nurture sequence. And they immediately start getting 10 to 15 different emails from speakers and they just kind of shut down and they either unsubscribe or they just stick them all in the trash folder and don't look at them anymore. But if you send them one email, when they opt in and you say, Hey, I'm so glad that you have joined my community. Here's the freebie that you opted in for? Don't worry. I'm not going to inundate you with emails. You'll hear back from me in about a week or so. And we'll start to get to know each other then. That way when they go, oh, you do get it. You understand how I feel, but also you're going to stand out because a lot of those speakers are going to be sending an email every day or every other day for a week or so. And then they're going to go on their normal email list. Whereas if you just wait a week, you're going to start up. As soon as those other people are wrapping up and they're going to feel like you see them, you hear them, you understand them. But also, they might actually read your email. So that is one thing. And then another thing is follow up with the summit host. Honestly, that is one of the things that so many speakers. Don't do after a summit is over, is just check them at the host, say, Hey, is there anything I can do for you? Are you going to evergreen the summit? That's something not a lot of the time a host may not be thinking about because they just put in three to six months worth of work and they're just ready to go take a break on the beach or go hike in the mountains and did just an brain fog from the summit. But. If, if you, you, as a speaker, you're going to get so much more out of an evergreen summit that you've participated in because you can keep sending people there. It stays as a resource for your audience when they can keep going back and get 48 to 72 hours of access to your session and everybody else's and you get to keep being that connector. And then also when you get those questions from people that you. Maybe you could answer it, or maybe you couldn't, but it's not in your wheelhouse. It's not your area of expertise. You can send them back over to the evergreen summit. And the host is going to remember you and the host is going to then go refer you out to other summit hosts and their podcast or friends, and maybe even in-person conferences. You never know where that's going to go. So. Well, yes, it is really great. Getting the opt-ins getting new people in your community. Maybe even making some sales now or down the road from it. Those connections with the hosts can be really great. I've had tons of people who have turned into joint venture partners where like maybe we do a code workshop or something like that because we either spoke at the same summit or they hosted a summit. Or I was the host of a summit. They spoke at. You never know where those connections are going to go. So think beyond just the attendees, even go make sure you're connecting with this other speakers and connecting deeper with a host so that you can continue those relationships. [00:25:11] Diane: okay. I want to know what the worst thing you've seen a speaker do, What's your biggest pet peeve? [00:25:18] Jenn: Oh, there's a few. So one of them is not reading. I've had summit speakers who I've personally invited. Like I've gone out, I've done research on them. They're great fit their audiences. Well aligned the topic that they're speaking about. I, or that I invite them to speak about something I know they've talked about in the past and they say yes, and it's usually one of those quick yeses where they get back to me within less than 24 hours. And then a week later, I'll get an email responding back to the original one where I'm, it's not like super huge email, but it's not short. Like I put all of the really pertinent information in there and then link them a few times to the speaker info page where it has like everything in there. But I'll get an email back from that first email that says, Hey, when is the summit running? And I look at the email and I sitting there thinking it's literally in my original email, in the first paragraph. Also it's in the speaker info page about 15,000 times. It's really not that hard. Fine. [00:26:16] Diane: And also if you've agreed to it, why is it already on your calendar? [00:26:19] Jenn: And that's you? It doesn't happen super often. Because I'm selective really, really selective about who I invite, but just read in the other thing is if you see a deadline on the speaker info page and like everything else lines up, like, you know that the promotion window is fine. You don't have any conflicts or maybe you do have a conflict, but you still really want to be part of this email, the host and ask them, ask them questions. It shows that you read things and trust me, I'd really rather, I answer a question where you're like, I just want to make sure this is okay. Versus you assuming it's okay. Or, and saying yes. And then it's really not okay. Or you assuming it's not okay. And we both miss out on having you in the summit. I've had speakers who said, Hey, I'm really booked up. I have some in-person speaking engagements. I have a launch coming up. It's going to be really tight for me to get you the presentation by the deadline that you've said, is it okay if I push it a week for me to the summit? I'll be totally honest. I put my deadline for speaker presentations about three weeks before I actually have to have them for situations like that. I had at least three speakers at my last summit get COVID before they were supposed to turn in their presentations, that was kind of crazy, but yeah . Another thing. I haven't had a speaker do this, but I've seen it at other like my clients events and some, some that's that every, I think maybe once or twice at summits that I've attended, where someone is very clearly taking a presentation that they recorded for another summit and just sent that in. And the host either wasn't paying attention or didn't actually watch the video beforehand because they literally say welcome to ABC summit and you're actually attending XYZ summit. If you want to repurpose the summit presentation from something else where you don't mention the summit anywhere else in the presentation, drop it, chop off the first bit, record a new introduction, edit it. It's totally fine. I, as a summit host, do not at all mind you saving time as a summit speaker, but I also don't want you promoting someone else's summit at my summit and then make sure that you have. Copyright to all the stuff that you put in there. I've had speakers go and adding music beds underneath their presentation. I don't know if you have the rights to it. And that means that I don't know if I have the rights to it. And like I have in my contract and I speaker agreement that you need to make sure you have rights to this, that I am not leaving. But at the same time, I don't really want to get into that and potentially risk that. So those are probably my top three things that I see people do wrong. [00:28:57] Diane: I have to say it like in my experience. Impressing a summit host is actually a very low bar. Like not in like your content, but I never failed to be surprised when I respond to an email on searching something or confirming something or submit something on time. The sheer gratitude that pause. All I did was do what I said I was going to do. And then you realize how bad people are at actually doing those basics of reading the email. Like you said, doing a presentation that's actually applicable, of showing up and engaging. So that, that blows my mind every single time. So. I feel like summits are kind of like meetings and corporate. Like when you start in corporate, there's all these meetings. You're like, Ooh, what happens in the meetings? How did they get him? Why are they at the meetings? And you want to be at the meetings, right? Fortunately someone's, don't carry on like meetings where you just wish they were an email. But I feel like you, you spend a lot of time going, how are people getting onto these summits? Because by the time you hear about the summer, Like people are already speaking. Like there's no, like I'm hosting a summit who would like to speak kind of to Dar that happens. Right. They only announced the summit when they have speakers. So for people who are like, okay, this is new to me. I want to speak at a live event or a summit in 20, 22. Like how do they even find the gig? Like, forget about all the strategy we just talked about. How do they even get onto one because initially you're not probably not going to be invited. You are probably going to have to pitch. Right, [00:30:30] Jenn: Well, it's hard to find people to pitch to first off. Cause like you said, no, not many people are announcing it. It is becoming a little bit more common to do speaker calls, but they're few and far between. And typically they happen in very specific types of groups and. One of the best ways that I have to recommend getting in front of summit hosts before they choose their summit speaker lineup is I actually have a speaker directory, so a little bit of a self plug, but that's just because it is such a really great resource. I get pitched from it all the time for people inviting me to speak at summits. And I actually had somebody the other day go and DME on Instagram and say, Oh, my gosh. I literally have been on the speaker directory for a day or maybe two days. I don't even think has been two days, but I just got invited to a summit already and she's super excited to have me. And she said she's been having trouble finding folks. And so. It's stuff like that. It's really easy to get in front of summit hosts who were looking by being on the directory, because they're literally looking for people to speak at summits over there. And it's really easy for them to find folks. Cause we haven't really can filter by topics and do searches and stuff like that. So it's totally. You can go and find that@virtualsummitsearch.com and I would love to have you, the more people that we have on the directory, the better summits are going to be, because hosts are going to find people that actually want to speak at summits. Cause that's the thing. There are plenty of times where I find folks I'm like, oh my gosh, you would be perfect. You're exactly who I'm looking for. And I approached them. They go, I don't actually speak at Sundance. No I've wanted you. So. That's the thing about the directory is everybody who's on. There is someone who wants to speak at summits. Lot. Most of them have spoken at summons, but even if you haven't, you can add like your speaking experience for a podcast or in person events and stuff like that, and showcase yourself that way and we make it so they can contact you directly. From there. You don't go through us. We're not a speaker bureau. We just connect people with hosts and speakers. So that's one way. And then , if you've done that and maybe you're starting to get some summits, but you want to make sure you're getting more, one of the easiest ways to just tell people that you want to speak at summits. If you tell your business friends who probably have other business friends who might be hosting summits in the future, I tend to go to my friends first. I ask them, Hey, do you know anybody who speaks on this topic? I'm looking for a summit speaker. And if they know that you want to speak at summits, they're way more likely to recommend you. So those are probably the two best ways that I would recommend for getting booked on summits initially. [00:33:08] Diane: Amazing. This has been such a good, walk through of exactly what to think about, because I think people get just blinded by it. They're like, Ooh, I'm going to get to speak in a Semaj like, that's exciting without actually thinking through all the moving pieces. So I think that's been really helpful to finish up. I always ask my guests a couple of questions first up. What is your number one lifestyle boundary for your business? [00:33:32] Jenn: I'm really bad about boundaries. [00:33:34] Diane: Maybe it's not doing summits where someone says that you have to do have a 5,000 person email list. [00:33:40] Jenn: That's definitely a boundary. I have, like, I respond back to those cause I really want to educate people because part of my mission is no more slimy summits that came about as I was talking to some clients and other summit speakers about all the weird pitches we get. And so our rally cry became no more slimy summits. [00:33:58] Diane: Okay. And then what is the worst piece of cookie cutter advice you've been given in your journey as an entrepreneur? [00:34:04] Jenn: Oh, be on all the platforms probably I don't like social media very much. Like I'm starting to like Instagram, but I really hate writing. So like, clubhouse is great when I remember to get onto it. But when people tell you, you have to be on Facebook and Instagram and Twitter and Snapchat and LinkedIn and take talk and YouTube. And I'm just like, I don't have time for that. And I really don't care about most of those. [00:34:29] Diane: yeah. it's exhausting. Just listening to you. List them. [00:34:31] Jenn: It's insane. So, yeah, that's probably the worst advice I've gotten. [00:34:36] Diane: piece. Yeah. for sure. I can relate. Oh, this is such an interesting behind the scenes that a lot of people don't know about until you experience your first summit. As you are anti social media, where is the best place for people to connect with you? If they do want to keep talking about this? [00:34:53] Jenn: uh, You can either find me over@virtualsummitsearchdotcomorseveralthesummit.com, but I am starting to get more active on Instagram because I discovered I really do like doing reels. [00:35:02] Diane: Awesome. Great. Well, they can find you on Instagram. I'll be sure to link it. Thank you So. much, Jen. This is great. [00:35:08] Jenn: Yeah, thanks for having me. I had so much fun talking about all this.